#86 | Big Thinking to Create an Extraordinary Interior Design Business with Andrea Liebross
Welcome to the Designers Oasis podcast. I'm your host, Kate Bendewald. If you're tired of one-size-fits-all all advice to running your interior design business, you're in the right place. Join me each week as we dive into topics to help you run a thriving interior design business. Without the hustle. We'll talk about the business of design, but also mindset and mental health because I know when you thrive, so will your life and business. It wasn't that long ago that I stepped away from my corporate interior design job to build my own design business so that I could realize my own creative dreams, have more time with the people I love, and serve my clients at the highest level, while making more money than I ever could have working for someone else. It wasn't always easy, and I made my share of mistakes along the way. Fast forward to today. And I've learned a thing or two. Since then I've built multiple six-figure interior design businesses on authentic word-of-mouth referrals with many repeat clients. And I want to share it all with you the ambitious, inspired, and I get it occasionally overwhelmed interior designer who shares this dream of transforming lives through the art of interior design, You can do this. Thank you for letting me spend part of this day with you. Let's get to it.
Kate Bendewald
Welcome to the designers Oasis podcast. I'm your host, Kate Bendewald. We have a very exciting guest with us today we're joined by Andrea labrosse, a dynamic business and life coach who specializes in empowering unapologetically ambitious women entrepreneurs. Andrea is not only a seasoned speaker, but also the insightful host of the time to level up podcast. With a unique approach. Andrea guides her clients to merge bigger thinking with robust systems, creating a powerful synergy that propels them towards success. Her mission is to help women entrepreneurs, not only achieve their goals, but to also unlock the freedom of time, money and energy they passionately seek. In September of 2023, Andrea achieved the remarkable milestone of releasing a best selling book, she thinks big, the entrepreneurial Woman's Guide to moving past the messy middle, and in to the extraordinary, which is accompanied by a transformative workbook, I just want to say mine is in the mail. I am so excited to get my hands on this book. Through her work. Andrea has become a beacon of inspiration for those who are navigating the challenges of entrepreneurship, offering practical insights and strategies to navigate a journey from uncertainty to extraordinary success. So get ready for a candid conversation with Andrea, as we explore the intersections of ambition, strategy and personal growth. Hi, Andrea, welcome to the show. Hi, Kate.
Andrea Liebross
Thanks for having me.
Kate Bendewald
Oh, my gosh, I am so thrilled to hear from you. Because when I first read the title of your book, messy metal, I thought to myself, Lord, get in my life, I need to know what that looks like. Because I am personally convinced that we always experienced the messy middle during times and during seasons, right. I don't feel like my whole life is a big best. But there are times where I feel like I'm in the messy middle. So I am really interested and diving into this conversation and this topic with you. So thanks for joining me today.
Andrea Liebross
Thanks for having me.
Kate Bendewald
Yeah. So in your work, you emphasize the importance of a belief plan. I love that term, to counteract what you call the inner frenemy that is holding us back. So could you start by sharing more about what inspired this concept of a belief plan and why you believe it's crucial for success in business?
Andrea Liebross
Sure, so I think all entrepreneurs you know, we all know that it's a great idea to have a business plan. And usually the business plan as something goes something like this, you've got some goals. And then that maybe if you're lucky, you've thought even deeper than that and you have a vision of where you want to go and then You've created some goals on how you want to get there. And then you think, Okay, what do I really need to do to achieve the goals, and it all kind of builds on each other. And I am a huge, huge proponent of business plans. In fact, I have all my clients create what I call a vision to action organizer, which does just that it kind of helps them download what their vision is where they want to be in 10 years, three years, and then we dissect it even further, we turn it into action, the second half of it, where we talk about one year goals, what are we going to do this quarter, and we get down to the nitty gritty. However, none of that can happen, unless we believe that it can happen. So I think that we need yes, we need this action plan. But we also need a belief plan. And we need a bit of a time plan. And we need a life plan. And we could have podcasts on all those topics. But today, in what we're talking about this belief plan, it really is the intersection between the dream and the goal. Okay, so how I like you, how I like to kind of describe it is a dream is first of all different than a goal. Okay? A lot of times people think, Oh, should my goals be dreamy? Should my dream be a goal? Like what should? What should it be right? But a dream? is I like to think of it as being somewhat nonsensical, like you do. It's something that doesn't quite make sense. It's actually pretty aspirational. And it may be outrageous. It sometimes has Tengiz of being even like, euphoric if this actually happened, oh, my gosh, I don't know what would what my life would look like. But a goal goals, on the other hand, are kind of boring. I mean, goals are great. And I want you to have goals, I mean, on that. And we can talk about kinds of goals of theirs. Like I like to talk about smarter goals, and then wild goals. But this belief plan is kind of where the rubber hits the road. So if you think about what, what is what you want, where you want to go in your business, or where you want to go in life, what has to happen is that you kind of have to meet but I call your future you. Okay? So your future you is the person that has already achieved the goal probably even gotten past the goal, and is living the life that they want to live and has the business they want to have, which I think includes probably some time freedom, some financial freedom, probably some energy freedom, like well, you're spending your energy on what you want to spend it on. So that future you is potentially a year three years, five years, 10 years down the road. Right. And that future you believes and has now seen the evidence because our brains are already always searching for evidence, right? It seems seeing the evidence that this is all possible. Okay, so the belief plant is kind of born out of the thinking of the future you like I have to trust okay, that I am capable of creating all of this and in order to hold that trust or that belief, I have to go ask the future you what I should be doing in future you is like oh, well, if you want to have a business where you can work it at the beach, then you're an interior designer. A lot of times interior design is done sort of hands on or in located on location then you better develop a team or create a team you better start hiring some people that can be like the boots on the ground even if you're the brain on the beach, right? Yeah, so So the belief plan that but you but present you like today you actually especially today you seen that we had before we started recording Kate had to go deal with a little child issue. So especially you today, right? Always would be like, that's never gonna happen. That's craziness. Like how am I gonna run a business from a beach or have people here that can do all the work? So the present you is not believing? It's just like no way Jose? This is what happened today. No, no, no sorry. Past you again, that that hasn't happened to past you past you as no evidence past us like huh, yeah. And I'm also going to tell you these all these other things that may not happen that you've kind of been thinking about. So past you isn't very helpful, present you is not very helpful, but future you is super helpful. And they're the ones that kind of help fuel this belief and again, the belief also kind coincides with trust. And if you're a big thinker, which is another topic, I love talking about big thinkers, trust they they have an acronym for what trust stands for its thought options, real problem, what's the real problem, which is usually just a feeling. You're able to embrace the things that are unexpected. You have to support him to take action, we can get into all that. But you've got to really trust that this all can happen. That's really what belief is. So it's not a dream. And it's not a goal. It kind of meshes the two together.
Kate Bendewald
I want us to go back for just a second, because I think you just touched on something super cool that I love. It's and you really drawing a line between this idea of thinking big and trusting. And one of the things that I've personally been talking about here on the podcast, as well as inside my program is learning to trust ourselves. And so can you go back for a minute and sort of share that acronym and how that plays into this belief plan? Because I think that's really important. What you what you shared there, and I want to make sure that we didn't Yeah, so.
Andrea Liebross
So trust is what big thinkers like if you said, what are the keys to being a big thinker, okay. So number one, they access future you, but they also recognize that they have thought options. Okay, so T stands for interest, thought options. What do I mean by that? I mean, that there's so many things that you could think you could think, okay, it's we're recording this, it's the end of February. Oh, my gosh, it's still winter. And most of probably our listeners where they're listening, right, it's still winter. I'm totally fed up with this cold weather. When is spring coming? That's a thought. It's an option, okay? Or you could think, Oh, I can't wait for winter to end. I don't want it to end I love skiing, and all the snow is going to be gone. Okay, that's a thought option. Both are out there on the table. Okay, no one no, one of those isn't better than the other. So big thinkers realize they have thought options. They have thought options on how they're going to think about their future. Like I can create whatever I want to create, or you know, that beach living on the beaches in my is totally possible. Or they could say No way, Jose, I'm staying back. That would never happen, I won't even try. So that's what T stands for. Thought options are stands for real problem. And the real problem usually is not a problem at all, the real problem is that you don't want to experience a negative feeling. Okay, you don't want to feel disappointed. You don't want to feel frustrated. You don't want to feel guilty. I was just right before we got on, I was doing a coaching call with an interior designer. And she's feeling guilty. Because her business at this point is it's it's she's got clients coming out the wazoo. She's hiring team members, she's really exploding. And she's got four kids under the age of 12. And she's feeling guilty, that she shouldn't be spending more time with them. And not all this time on her business. So the real problem isn't necessarily that she doesn't have enough team members, or that there's not enough hours in the day, the real problem is that she's feeling guilty. Okay, so usually a negative feeling is the real problem, which is kind of, in a way, if you want to think about it, it's kind of a little bit of a relief, like, oh, I can solve everything. Or if my thinking that how I feel is a problem, that that's it, I can change that. Okay. And you can change that actually, by how you think what you're thinking about. So a lot of the coaching I do people grow businesses, is yes, we are talking about how to hire and what questions you should ask and how you should onboard and all those things. But when it comes down to it, sometimes it goes into the feeling category. So that's our interest. You interest stands for uncertainty, or unknown. And if you're going to grow this business, create the time money and brainpower freedom you want. You have to be okay. With being things being uncertain or unknown. Yeah, yeah. Hard, right. Yeah, like super hard. Because we don't really know what's gonna happen this afternoon, or tomorrow, or anytime. And we really want to because that would feel it make us feel safe and in control and all the things but yeah, we can't we don't write right we don't. So how do you how do you embrace it? You just have to kind of say to yourself, This is one of my favorite lines that like used, oh, this is the part where it gets difficult. Or this is the part where I have to rearrange my whole day. Or oh, yeah, this is the part where I feel like I'm being super unprofessional. But that's okay. Like, it's it's yeah. That's it. That's all you have to do. I do a lot of I do console calls, okay, because I do a lot of console calls, often at the end of the call, when we're kind of deciding how to move forward. Because I always say at the end, we're going to make a decision on how we're going to move forward, because I help people make a lot of decisions. This is kind of a trial one trial run. I hear people say, Oh, my gosh, Andrea, this sounds awesome. I totally need what what you're doing, I can, I can see 100 ways where I could benefit, but I'm just gonna think about it. Okay, so there's this, just gonna think about it, or I want to sleep on it. Or I'm gonna ask my husband what he thinks or like, those kinds of things? Which again, totally like, Yes, we all say that our brains are offering that up. Because we want to make totally sure we're all in all the things. But when I say, Hey, can I can I? Can I push into my coach hat on just for a minute? Sure. So then I'll say, what exactly are you thinking about? Tonight? When you're lying in bed? What are you going to be thinking about? What are you? What are you trying to figure out? No one has really great answer. They're just gonna, like sit with this. Or they'll give me like, I'm going to check my bank account. Well, you already checked your bank account, you kind of know what's in there, you know, it's not like, you have some idea. So what's happening there is that they're not comfortable with the uncertainty of what, for example, engaging in coaching might look like or, Hey, I don't know, if I want to hire this designer. I mean, I could go to Pottery Barn and pick out everything myself. And I mean, I guess it would turn out, okay. So they're, they're just, you have to be okay. With uncertainty is the bottom line. If you're going to think bigger, and think, oh, my gosh, if I could have a designer that helped me finish this house, I would feel like I was walking on the moon, it would be so great. Or if I could have a coach in my back pocket to bounce ideas off of to help guide me when I don't know what to do next. makes things so much easier. So yeah, that's the uncertainty piece. Yeah, yeah. I call it asks,
Kate Bendewald
I say control is an illusion.
Andrea Liebross
It's an illusion. It's an illusion, so much. So the s part the Essent. Trust. Every big thinker, secures support. Ah, okay. So S stands for secure support. You cannot be a big thinker and do it all alone. Because your brain is going to try to protect you and give you all the reasons that's kind of where the frenemy comes in. All the reasons why this isn't possible. You're gonna hit I call it like you're climbing a mountain, and there's a trail, and there's a log across the trail, and you say to yourself, oh, my, I don't know, should I go just turn around and go back and in this log looks pretty hard to get over? No, you need to secure support, you've got to have someone with you a Sherpa or a guide, that's gonna say, Okay, what if we went around it? What do you think? Or we could go back, but there's also this other trail, that might be an easier route than turning all the way back. So we always like to have, like, when we're little we like to have stuffed animals and things to keep us secure when we're adults. Like, we don't have that anymore. But we still need to secure support. That's a huge, huge, huge thing. I could talk about that forever.
Kate Bendewald
Sure, yeah. Because support looks different for a lot of people. It does, it
Andrea Liebross
doesn't we could talk about life support or business support or support with managing things, all kinds, but the last T and trust stands for take action. So we are notorious for taking what I call passive action. So passive action is researching. Passive action is actually listening to a podcast and not doing anything with it. Passive action is reading a book and just having it sit on the shelf. So I love books. I totally love podcasts. I will Google anything. But that's all passive action. That's not really moving the needle. Right? Right. You've got to take some massive action in order to fulfill the you know, that make those beliefs reality. And it's not going to come just by reading or googling or asking 1000s of people what to do. Yeah, yeah,
Kate Bendewald
I am. I am guilty of that and my past and I've gotten so much better at identifying what I get into research mode, right? And I typically it's when I'm getting ready to embark on something new, and I don't really have a roadmap for it. It's totally normal to do research, we should be doing research, yes, in a lot of the work that we do. But there comes a point in time where it's like, okay, you've read enough, you've researched enough, you kind of know how to do this. Now go do it. And it's all you know, I definitely don't do this as much or to the extent that I used to, but I'll find myself constantly seeking for answers. And this goes back to the trust thing where there is a moment where I just have to step back and say, Wait a second, even if you do it imperfectly, it's time to get moving, it's time to get going and start to take some action and get out of that research mode. And I can see why that's such an important part of this framework that you've developed. Because that action piece is none of it works unless you start to take some imperfect action. You mentioned front of meow just a minute ago. So I'm going to come back to that. I knew you say that the front of me is an internal voice that acts as a friend, but it doesn't truly believe in our capabilities. So how can we identify and address this frenemy voice when it creeps up so that it doesn't keep us from making the kind of progress that we're aiming to to go for?
Andrea Liebross
Yeah, it kind of throws up a lot of roadblocks. So the frenemy voice like I call it like that little voice in the back of your head that thinks you're being very helpful and keeping you safe and on track. And a lot of times, I'll encourage my clients to give it a name. Usually, it's kind of that, you know, who's that person in high school who thought they knew everything, that kind of name. So so the frenemy tells you things like, Are you sure you should do this? You don't have enough information? It might take too long, that don't charge them that they'll never pay it? I don't know, if you brought someone on? Would you have enough work for them to do? I mean, you'd have to keep them going, okay? Or is that client too big for you. And we can you take that whole job on, you've never done something like that. So it thinks it's being really helpful because it's feeding you kind of messaging based on the past, because maybe you haven't done it, or it is bigger than that, okay. And it kind of falls into what's called the motivational triad. So there's a concept where we want things to be easy. We want them to be comfortable, we want to be efficient, we don't want to waste any time. So that front of me is really representing all of that. And what I say is, you have to have like the real you who lives in the front of your head in front of your brain, you're the real you needs to stand up. And that's the you that has these beliefs. And it needs to say, thanks so much for reminding me that I've never done this before. Thank you. Appreciate it. However, here is my plan, and I'm moving forward. Or you can say, You are so right, that yes, I have never charged this amount. And this is going to be my first time let's go. Okay, so you've got to it. I always say like, acknowledge it. Thank it, and then do what you really are going want and are capable, or setting out to do. It's kind of the Yeah, yeah.
Kate Bendewald
Right, because our brains are wired to protect us. But right, we, yeah, and it keeps us alive. It certainly has for me, but there's a point at which that voice gets on autopilot and gets into the habit of speaking out of turn, or trying to influence our decision making. And we have to be aware of that so that we can recognize when it's our brain truly trying to protect us, right? Because I think that when we talk about trust, especially with women, there is intuition that we need to listen to, and we do need to trust. And I think there's a real fine line between trusting that and then also knowing when it's fear coming in. And so, you know, I get because I am usually a quick decision maker and I'm trying to slow some of that down a little bit. I kind of get the person who's like I do need to take a beat on this guy cuz I do sometimes need to work out like, what part of this is fear. And what part of this is just my intuition saying, I don't know if this is the right time or the right way or whatever. Not speaking specifically about you, working with you, but just in general when making big decisions. But you can get stuck in that trap or you can get stuck in like playing small when it's you're completely on I'm aware that those thoughts creeping out or just simply fear. And, and, and none of it is, is real intuition. And I don't have a good answer for that. I just know that we, we do have to check ourselves and try to use discernment to figure out when it's real intuition that's keeping you safe and and helping you to make a right choice. And then also, when it's fear that's just like, needs to take a hike. So.
Andrea Liebross
So I think, like, when I asked that question, what exactly are you thinking about?
Kate Bendewald
Yeah,
Andrea Liebross
I think it's so valuable to say, I don't know, there's something that I'm, that's, I don't want to sometimes you'll say there's something that's holding me back, I just have to explore a little bit more as to what that is. And if it is just fear, or if it is something else. And that I appreciate that, because at least they've identified what they're trying to pull apart, or what they're trying to play with so many times that we don't give ourselves that opportunity. And we just kind of forge ahead without having put any thought into it. Or the side. I don't want to like this is too I can't even think about this. And we retract, when there's usually some happy medium in the middle. Yeah,
Kate Bendewald
that makes a lot of sense. That makes sense. I'm reminded of a time when I this was 2017. And we were living in Denver, and my business had just grown by leaps and bounds. And it was a very exciting time. And there was my team was growing, and I was ready to move us into an office space outside of our home. And I signed a lease on a really, really cool space here in Denver overlooked downtown. It was an old warehouse building just really cool architecture. I was super excited about it. My team was excited about it. And sorry, I hadn't signed the lease, I had the paperwork, I had a hand check on it. I told him about it. And I was excited about it. And I went home that night to do the paperwork. I think I filled it out. But then I woke up the next morning, and I was just like, there is something telling me this is not the right, either place or time or something. And I don't know what this is. But it was a loud voice. And I was just like, oh, maybe I'm just afraid of the commitment to the money. Yeah, like the rent, right. And I really was convinced that that's what it was. And it might have been a part of that. That might have been part of it. In fact, I know it was because it felt like a real big girl move was face with employees with a lot more overhead. You know, so the next day, my husband had a job offer in Texas, that I'll be frank, I've talked about this on here before, I wasn't super excited about moving especially to Texas, I grew up in Texas and wasn't want to go back there. Right? It was this specific job was extremely exciting. He had been looking for something for a really long time and had a lot of potential. And I was quite frankly, at a time where I was up to my I was completely overwhelmed with work. And this was like the little sliver of sunlight that I was like, maybe this is my opportunity to like, start fresh and like, get everything. Start a new and that's ultimately what we ended up doing. But I looking back now, and I didn't know that at the time. But looking back, I do think that was a moment of intuition. Because I would not have been able to that move would not have been able to happen. If I had already moved into that space and have that commitment. I would have said sorry, my my boobs are firmly planted here. You're gonna have to find another opportunity. And I just, I don't I don't know, ultimately, I guess it's because he had that opportunity that came up that made me realize, oh, that may have been intuition telling me. Life has a different plan for you. And anyway, we ended up back in Denver, it's all fine. But I think trusting yourself is that's an important thing that you bring up there. So I love that and identifying the front of me and acknowledging it, thinking it and then moving on. So now, it's not just about strategic business plans or action oriented approach belief plays belief plays a significant role, right? We have to believe as we talked about this right at the beginning, because that shapes our our mindset and our actions. So how do you strike a balance between strategic planning and cultivating a strong belief system for success?
Andrea Liebross
So I think Like, if we go back to the goal setting piece of the puzzle. Okay, so I don't know, everybody's heard of SMART goals, like most people have heard of SMART goals, right? All right, I love smarter goals which add in a little bit of exciting and risky. And we can do those till the cows come home and I, we I do them with guys, all my clients have smarter goals. And they also have what I call wild goals. Okay, so wild goals are a little bit more wild, they're a little bit more friendly with the belief plan. Okay. And the wild goals though W in wild stands for you have to be willing to, I could use an expletive but you have to be willing to not
Kate Bendewald
say swear words.
Andrea Liebross
You've got to be willing to suck at it. Okay, you gotta be willing to suck at it. Well,
Kate Bendewald
that's your
Andrea Liebross
Well, I mean, I don't know. Because then podcasts you have a little e next to your podcast, which I do. I got it. I know about that. So you gotta be willing to suck at it. You have to be willing to try something that maybe won't work.
Kate Bendewald
Oh, Andrea, that's so hard. That's so hard.
Andrea Liebross
I know. I know. I know. But if we stick with everything in a nice little box, yeah. Okay. We're probably not going to make as much progress as if we are when we kind of think outside the box, or we think bigger. And usually big thinking feeds, things doing things that maybe you're not so great. Okay. Yeah. So your goals have to be kind of W Wilde willing to suck at it. They also have to be I would they have to ignite you. They have to light you up, that you have to be excited about them. And they might even feel a little bit impossible. Okay, so the ice stands for Ignite and impossible. And when we're being strategic. Oftentimes, we forget about that part. Because we're so focused on what is the next best move, and I'm always about what's the next best step like I love that phrase. But there has to be a bit of pushing you outside the box. That L stands for, let it be easy. Okay, so this is another interesting one, where we love complicating things and thinking about all the 16 million steps Oh, me, me. I don't know.
Kate Bendewald
Seeing right now. I am I am a I am I have been public about this. But I am trying to get better, but I overcomplicate things unnecessarily. And so my word for the year is simplicity. I love this, Andrea? Yes.
Andrea Liebross
So I'm actually doing a workshop next week called are to scale with simplicity and confidence. Yeah, Mike. Yes. So during that, but I also have a little red button that sometimes I bring on podcast that's like the red easy button. Like, what if we press the easy button? That was easy? How could we make this easy, or there's always a way, there's always way in simple, can actually be hard sometimes, like I use the thing when I think about when I go to the gym, and I work out with a trainer and they say, Okay, we're not using any equipment today. We're not using any weights, we're just using body weights. So your brains like oh, this is simpler. This is simpler. But it's still hard. It's still hard. Right? So I want to go to the easy place. Like how can we make it easy? Sure. So that's a that's something. And then the last piece is for D in wild, do it for fun. Like the strategy should have some fun in it. And if it's not fun, we're not going to keep going. That's just the way it goes. Right? Think about little kids. Well, that's not fun. I don't want to do it. We're the same way. Right? We want it to be fun. So to join strategic thinking, with a belief plan or something that's not necessarily like concrete, solid. I like to have these wild goals in the middle kind of tying them together. And, and I also encourage my clients and we were doing this today 25 fails, like make a list of 25 things that you are willing to fail at in order to achieve the goal. And that really, if you can do that, that that goes a long way.
Kate Bendewald
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Kate Bendewald
It's not true just for interior designers, but but I know this is true, especially for this group. We live in a world where we are constantly feeding our brains imagery of perfection. Because we live on Instagram and Pinterest, where we are seeing the best of the best. Oftentimes, we're seeing highly curated images that are styled shot for photography. And the the work that goes into styling for photo shoot is tremendous. People don't understand it until you've done it. Often photo edited it before they're ever done. That's the world where we live right is seeing that. And so we tend to think I believe that we don't see that work that goes behind that. And so I think it feels like there's very little wiggle room for fucking up. And so this permission to make a mistake. Lots of them even. I think as is refreshing, although could be a little scary for some people who might misinterpret what you're saying. So when you talk about making mistakes, obviously, we don't want to make the kind of mistakes that are going to cause us to have a client relationship gets soiled or ruin our reputation or, you know, change the trajectory of our business. So when you say make these mistakes, what kind of mistakes are you talking about that we can safely feel like we can make without the attack kicking in? Okay, I'm, I'm asking for a friend, you're asking for a friend.
Andrea Liebross
Yet you are living in this world of highly curated perfection imagery, all the things, you know, houses that no one lives in, right? What happens when the when people come home and the dog is you know, throwing up on the rug? What's gonna happen? So, okay, so the kind of mistakes I'm talking about are really things that happen, that aren't fails. Okay. So, actually, I don't even think I don't want to use the word mistake or fail. You're either winning or learning. That's it. You're winning, or learning. So, couple examples. You hire someone, and they end up not being a good fit. Okay, so I hear this all the time. I already went through this. I hired the wrong person. It was so exhausting. I don't want to do that again. Yeah. Okay. And I like to say, Well, what did you what happened there? What did you learn? Well, I need someone who knows X, Y, and Z or I need someone that's older, younger with this experience. You learned there was no mistake. Okay? Another example might be in your marketing. Okay, so you you're marketing to the whole world, because you can help anyone. Okay. And yet, no one's coming. But when you decide to market, just two people with kids under the age of 10, who have a dog and a cat, and live in a 4000 square foot house, it got a lot easier. Yeah. Okay. So there's like, that's a it wasn't a fail. It wasn't a mistake. It's just whatever or you decide. I'm only going to use social media. I'm not sending any emails. I'm not doing any blogs. I'm not okay. Let's try it. Like let's it's like, I love to use the science experiment kind of thinking,
Kate Bendewald
Oh, yes. I listened to one of your podcast episodes where you talked about this, and I love this concept. So say more. Okay,
Andrea Liebross
so think back sixth grade, seventh grade, you know, you got your Bunsen burner. And you had to fit you have to do your science lab report where you had a hypothesis then you did your experiment with your partner. And then you had to write about what happened. Same thing in life. Okay? What's the hypothesis? Well, my hypothesis is that if I market to the whole world, I'm going to be able to help the whole world and more people are going to come to me. Okay, so let's do that. First, I would say, Go do it for three to six months, at least, to see what happens. And then let's, let's look at the data afterwards. Did all of a sudden were that was your phone ringing off the hook or not? Okay. So if you kind of think of it like that way, within that regard, it makes it so much easier. Like up note, the science experiment didn't work, I'm gonna change my hypothesis now. Or try it again. It just makes it easier to, for your brain to manage. And I think success in business is there's two ingredients, it's mindset. And IT systems and mindset is about 80% of it. And that is the kicker there. So that's another kind of way to manage your mind around some of the things you're trying. So that's my science experiment.
Kate Bendewald
Yeah, I love that it's it is so much of it is just trying something to see what works or putting out the shitty first draft and knowing that you're gonna have the opportunity to come back and reframe it. I remember, early on, and this was back in the period before we moved to Texas, and my business had done really well in terms of me getting volume of projects and clients. And I realized that while some of them were wonderful, there were a lot of them that were unfulfilling projects, whether it was the project itself, or the kinds of clients that I was attracting, but I realized, and this was, when I got my chance to restart, I sort of talked about my business story. But when I had the opportunity to sort of reboot, when we moved, it gave me the space to have some clarity. And what I realized, looking back at my website, at the copy, on my website, is that I was really, I didn't have a clear focus, even though I thought I did on who I wanted to work with. And that I really was casting a wide net in terms of the kinds of projects I was able to take on. And when I realized that, and I tweaked it to be more specific to a couple of things. One, that I really wanted to work with clients who felt like they were in their forever home, because I was tired of having conversations with people who were interested in their ROI on their projects, I don't give to how much money you make on the sale of this house. If you're worried about how much money you're gonna make on the sale of this house, this conversation is over, because I'm not interested in designing for future possible human, you're the person I'm interested in designing for. So that was one big move. And then also just making sure that the copy establish that I wanted to help clients who were facing really large scale renovations and projects. So I'm not interested in helping you pick out a light fixture for your room. Right, right, right. So this is like what's going on in the back of my mind. And the copywriting tweaks that I made, profoundly changed the trajectory of the kinds of clients and projects that I started to attract. And so I was able to attract, make more money with fewer clients and fewer projects. And that's an example of like, the original shitty first draft, making a mistake, not hope not being clear about who I was talking to casting a wider net, and you know it. But again, having that space and time to see it with clear eyes was really helpful too. But that's where we need. And almost not there's a word you used earlier, but like an accountability partner, a partnership will be like
Andrea Liebross
that I call it like a guide or a Sherpa. Or, you know, you need support, right, like support you need support you need to because going it alone is is not only lonely, but you tend to be your biggest roadblock. And when you're in your own I call it stuck in your own peanut butter jar. When you're stuck in your own peanut butter jar. You can't read the label, like you can't get out. It's too sticky in there. Right? So you're getting you're getting sucked in and you can't climb out. So you've got to have someone that's going to kind of read the label and help you see possibilities. I've just been kind of going through this with a couple interior designer clients. They're redoing how they're, well. Let's back up the proposals that they were sending out. We're taking them like tremendous amounts of time. Just Oh beyond. Okay, yeah. And they are painful. Just because it just was so much and I said have you considered simplifying your proposal process? Yeah. Oh, I don't know. I mean, the client wants all these details they want this, they want that, like a sure. Like, do you know that as a fact? Is that a fact some assumptions are being made? Yes, assumptions are being made. And so we actually got on our coaching call and in, in some of my coaching groups, or in all my coaching groups, there's a variety of industries people are in. Okay, so we use the people in the group as the guinea pigs. And we put up the proposal, we said, Okay, you out there, you know, non interior designer people, which proposal would you prefer to get what every person chose? I'll call it the simplified, non complicated proposal, like every one of them. And so then she said, Well, wouldn't you want to know what? This this? No, I'm hiring you. You're the expert. Yeah. Right. So there are a lot
Kate Bendewald
of times people conflate the proposal with the contract, like your contract is your contract your proposals?
Andrea Liebross
Right. So it just like all these, all these pieces of the puzzle with just like too much, so that's a good also, like, you had to kind of see the forest through the trees. And you can't really do that when you're home in your own forest. So yeah, yeah. Oh,
Kate Bendewald
my gosh, the imagery of the being stuck in peanut butter. That's because I was literally renting out a cup of peanut butter this morning to try to get it to go in the recycling. And I suppose like, This is dumb, I'm just gonna throw the trash. I'm not wasting gallons of hot water to go. Where it's probably not going to end up in the recycling stream anyway, just throw it away and move on. Okay. Right. Yes. Congratulations on your book. So the title of your book is she thinks big, actually, hold on, I want to get the full title in here. And she thinks wrong, long
Andrea Liebross
run, but it's good. That's good. The entrepreneurial
Kate Bendewald
Woman's Guide to moving past the messy, middle and in to the extraordinary. So can you give us just a little sneak peek into your book and share some of the key? I know, we've probably touched on a lot of them here today. But you know, what are some of the key takeaways or principles from the book that you're you're most proud of and want to share with our audience.
Andrea Liebross
So the book, I wrote the book so that it is more of a conversation, then it's not a textbook, it's not a dense, like, I must read it from page one, to 200. And whatever, all in order, it really is a book that you can pick up and flip to any page and find something helpful. Hopefully, I love that. Yeah. And I use a lot of client examples and stories, because I think that's the best way that we we learn, I broke the book into three sections. And this three parts, I call them parts really align with, I think the trajectory of anyone that is either growing a business has grown a business, or is just really evolving as a human. So the the first part is big mindset. And we talked a lot today about mindset and fears and beliefs, and all that's in the big mindset section, then we go into big plans. So how do you create that plan, that action plan, that time plan that life plan to kind of act, take those steps that you need to take to make something happen? And then the third part is big results, where I talk about freedom. So often, we create, we set out to create more time. Why did we start this entrepreneur thing, you know, in the first place, because we thought we might have more time or at least time freedom, we create more money, and that brings with it great, good and bad, right? We get now what are we doing with this money? Or how should we spend our money. And the another big result we have is we've got more opportunities, we've got more things to think about. So that part three kind of dives deep into what the I called big results are. So it really it can be read kind of in progression, or it can just be picked up and you can you know, go to page 170. And you're gonna find something amazing. There's also a toolkit that goes with the book, there's a bunch of free downloads, yep. That you can access. And then there's a workbook that you can purchase to kind of accompany each chapter and it really, like that's what I say is the work worth doing. There's the massive action. So if you're gonna have massive action, in sort of a passive action, experience like reading a book. It's when you actually do those questions. That light bulb start to go off when you'd kind of I mean The expression put pen to paper, but when you put pen to paper, the thinking becomes more clear. So that's kind of why and how I set the book up like I did. Yeah.
Kate Bendewald
I love that. And I love that you built a workbook that goes with it. Yes. And you work primarily with women.
Andrea Liebross
I like 99.9% There's a few men stragglers, but 99.9
Kate Bendewald
women and women identify? Yeah, I had somebody asked me one time, like, why so many niches towards women and in this space, and I just, I guess I'm saying thank you for doing this, especially for women. I know that, you know, women historically have not always had the same kind of opportunities or expectations that men have. And I'll just speak to my own story real quick. But you know, my, my mom, God bless her, you know, grew up in a different time. And her experiences as a young girl, you know, she, she grew up in the 50s. In South Texas, you know, her expectations, as a woman, as a young woman were very different than her brothers. Her brother's expectations were to go to college and make money and be a provider. And she and her sisters expectations were to go to college, but you don't have to finish just long enough to find a man that is going to finish and marry him and then have babies and you'll be set for life. And that's how the world works. And so, you know, unfortunately, when, by the time she had me, she still had some of those held beliefs about what women were expected to do. And so there wasn't a whole lot of expectations for me, growing up to play big, go big. Yeah, like the idea of owning my own business or you out earning my husband, we're just wildly you know, just we're not even in my wildest dreams it No, and, and I don't, I'm not, I don't blame my mom for that. I understand that. That was a that was conditioning because of partly generational, partly, maybe even geographic. But so we're all still, I think a lot of us are still sort of unraveling some of that those those mindsets that were get drawn down generationally, and it's not the same story for everyone. But I know it is for a lot of people. And so there is some some much needed sort of undoing there. For women especially,
Andrea Liebross
I find that, you know, one of the best parts of coaching women in general is the community that it creates. So you know, as we again, as we get older, it becomes harder to find community we find sometimes we got kids, sometimes we find community through that, or, you know, we can belong to different groups and organizations and all that. But within that, you're not you're finding people from a whole variety of work experiences. So the combination of entrepreneurial women together inside a community that safe, and that is not, you know, you're not competitors, either. It's, it's, it's special, it's really special, and I think it's needed. I think it's more needed than you realize, like, because if you don't have it, you don't kind of know what you're missing. And it propels you further, I mean, there's that whole site saying, like, you can go far alone or your father together or fast or whatever that is, but it's true. It's true. And, and you know, and the way I coach, it's like business and life are both fair game. So most of them are there in that with the intention of, hey, I want to grow a business or I want to get my scale my business or get it to the next level. Right. And by the way, I have all this other stuff going on in the background. And so I might, you know, bring that up in conversation like that's, that's fine. That's why we're here because all of that other stuff is impacting the business side of you. It's just like a big ball of yarn, totally intertwined. There's an image in the book, actually, I show a ball of yarn with all the strands labeled different pieces of your life and that's what happens. So that's kind of my style and my approach is that both are fair game like we're out here to grow businesses, but we're also human. Right?
Kate Bendewald
Yeah, exactly. Oh, that reminds me of a conversation this morning that I was having with Jenny Carlson show everybody who's been a longtime listener knows her cuz she's been on the show in just been around but we were talking about financial resilience. And, and as women, we are often tasked with We wear a lot of hats, right? You and I had to delay our the start of our podcast episode because I had a sick kid at home. Or that I had to go pick up from school, taking care of my aging parent volunteering in my community, which is definitely a choice that I make. A lot of women either take on those roles by choice or out of necessity doesn't matter either way, where I do think that a lot of men just have more focus on a seat, they can more singularly focus. Yes, these are very blanket statements that don't send me any hate mail. I will say like, my husband is very one track mind on work. He's still very hands on, but he doesn't do the kind of mental gymnastics that I do. Yeah,
Andrea Liebross
the invisible workload, I call it the invisible workload. Yeah. Right. The mental gymnastics, invisible workload. I think also, a lot of times we get, we get stuck thinking I can do this, or I can do that. And I always challenge everybody, like, why can't we do both? Like, let's figure out a way to do both. Not so that it adds more to your plate? I'm not talking about that kind of doable, but that it fulfills different needs different buckets for you. Yeah. And but figuring that out, like going through the gymnastics routine. Sometimes you need a hand to do that. Yeah. Like you haven't thought of all of the options, right? Or you haven't even considered something might be possible. And I think those aha moments where like, huh, I could, like, this is one thing that's happening in my world right now is I have a senior in college. He's graduating in May. And my parents and my mother in law, no, no, no one there is in good walking capacity there. They all kind of hobble on, they all think that they're going to graduation, on the, you know, 40,000 person campus, right. And they have made arrangements to fly to come and I and the more I think about this, this is just not it's not happening. It's not happening. Logistics, right? This is like, so I have had to kind of coach myself into the place of saying to them, which I haven't done yet, I'll report back isn't gonna happen, like, we're gonna have a party. And that would be an awesome time for you to come and celebrate. And you can watch it on Zoom. But I just don't see how this is feasible. And, you know, someone had to say that to be this. Yes. Like, have you considered just telling them? No, they can't come?
Kate Bendewald
Right. Like, you can be there and enjoy it. Without the stress. So no joy anymore, too. Right?
Andrea Liebross
They weren't willing totally what, let that that's true. I think this better for everybody. But in my business, I sometimes you need the same kind of like, Have you considered doing this? Oh, no, I haven't considered doing that. That's a good idea. So I
Kate Bendewald
love that I love that so much. I'm very grateful I have I have a new coach in my life. And there's a passion project that has been on the shelf for a really long time. And she's finally, and I've just said, like, I don't have time to do it. And I finally have used her as my guide to Okay, figure out the logistics, how do I continue to do my day to day, you know, running the podcast, running my program. Raising my family and still playing time to do this passion project. And we're making it work. But I definitely didn't have the capacity to do that on my own because I was stuck in my own peanut butter, as you would say. So. Oh, my gosh, Andrea, you have been a delight to listen to today and share so much wisdom, I cannot wait to get my book in hand. So I can read it. We'll make sure to link to that in the show notes. But in the meantime, could you share with our listeners where they might be able to find you online? Sure.
Andrea Liebross
So I'm on all the social media platforms, but Instagram is probably my best one Andrea dot Libras that coaching. If you go to Andrea's with an S links with an S, you're gonna find a link to to that handle. But you're also going to find a link to the book and some book goodies. And you're gonna find a link to my podcast, I have a podcast called Time to level up which Kate started listening to. So you can find that on all your favorite podcast players. And I'm always open for a conversation. Like I love just exploring things with people, you know, just shoot me a message and say, What do you think about this? And I would be happy to either shoot you back what I think about it or questions for you to help you think about.
Kate Bendewald
Well, that's an extreme offer. Yeah. Well, I am so grateful to have been able to share this day with you and to have this conversation and I know that a lot of our listeners are really going to appreciate what you share Our biggest today. Thank you. Appreciate it. Thank
Andrea Liebross
you. Thanks for having me. It's
Kate Bendewald
been fun. All right. Thanks, Andrea. Bye for now. Bye. Hey, friend, thank you so much for letting me spend a part of this day with you. I'm so passionate about helping designers like you. And I believe in a rising tide that only one of us does. Well, we all do better. So if you share this attitude of abundance with me, I want you to do just one little thing. Please share this episode with someone using might love it. And if you're feeling extra generous today, go ahead and take just 30 seconds to open your podcast app and leave us a five star rating and review. It's free for you to do and it helps me to be able to keep making more episodes and resources for you. However you choose to help please No, I appreciate you so very much. Thank you, my friend. Have a wonderful rest of your day. I'll see you soon.
